When Nicole Salvesen and Mary Graham met at university, they had no idea they’d one day be business partners. Graham studied English, history and architecture, while Salvesen focused on Middle Eastern studies, Arabic, theology, sociology and anthropology. After graduation, they both found themselves working for big names in London interior design—Graham for Cindy Leveson and Salvesen for Nina Campbell—before ultimately starting their own firm in 2013.

“We were always ambitious, not in an aggressive way, but we’re both hard workers, and if we do things, we do it properly,” Graham tells host Dennis Scully on the latest episode of The Business of Home Podcast. “I think we knew right from the beginning that we wanted to make this a really proper, successful business. Creativity and business acumen are not mutually exclusive, and I think in our industry, sometimes being business-like is a bit frowned upon, because then people think, ‘Well, you’re probably not that creative if you’re interested in the business side.’ We wanted to set out to prove that you can do both.”

The two have grown their firm to a team of eight, just released their first book, and launched an extensive product line that is expanding throughout the U.S. (more on that in a minute). As they grew their business, they developed a reputation for colorful, pattern-heavy and nostalgic spaces, and embraced being recognized for that style. “I think there’s a lot of shame in this industry to say that you have a house style; I don’t know why. We work on so many different projects for so many different clients, and we like to think that our projects look quite different, but there’s absolutely a thread running through those. And people will come to us and say, ‘I could just tell that was Salvesen Graham—it had your mark on it,’” says Salvesen. “We did a project in Mayfair, and they very kindly invited my family and I over for Christmas drinks. When we got there, my daughter whispered, ‘Mommy, I can tell you did this. It feels like you.’ That’s that sort of thing that runs through, and it’s quite gentle, I think, and I hope that’s what she saw in it.”

Crucial insight: The duo, who launched their own product line that spans fabric, wallpaper, lighting, accessories and furniture, have learned the differences between running an interior design firm and running a product-based business. “From a business perspective, the service side of the industry, to some degree, is quite out of your hands in terms of [whether a client might] get divorced or decide to sell a house; or with the economic situation, it can be so tumultuous,” says Graham. “To have a product line where you can scale it, where you can forecast much more accurately—we’re really enjoying that as a business model. You’ve got this one side of the business [where] you’re working a lot harder for less profit on the service side—it’s [still] very gratifying. But on the product side, it’s much more definable, and I think it’s really nice having that balance of the two.”

Key quote: “People might dress in the most colorful way with real confidence, and then when it comes to their interiors, they completely lose confidence. That’s so much of what we need to educate our clients [on]: Just have confidence with this,” says Salvesen. “We don’t like to push them too far out of their comfort zone, but where would the value in us be if we’re not pushing them to a level that’s beyond what they would be able to do themselves or they would be able to choose themselves?”

This episode is sponsored by Loloi and Blu Dot. Listen to the show below. If you like what you hear, subscribe on Apple Podcasts or Spotify.

The Thursday Show

Host Dennis Scully and BOH executive editor Fred Nicolaus discuss the biggest news in the design world, including the latest on tariffs, a recap of Vegas Market and why Arhaus is suing RH. Later, Philippe Desart, managing director of Belgian wallcoverings brand Arte, joins the show to talk about betting on the D&D Building for a New York flagship.

This episode is sponsored by Loloi. Listen to the show below. If you like what you hear, subscribe on Apple Podcasts or Spotify.